The Big Meeting 0
Apr16
Oh, this was necessary.
I won’t go into detail on our sex lives. Mel and I aren’t hardcore kink fanatics, but… we’ve dabbled. And if there’s one thing I know, it’s that you can’t plan a proper orgy. You just let the naked sexiness happen.
*cough* Allegedly anyway.
Oh hay, citizen? You don’t get to know SHIT or SHINOLA.
Looks like even the hard-left liberal politicians are starting to realize that firearms = safety. I’ve never understood why our domestic military bases are virtually unarmed.
Know what? I like this video better.
Listen to your elders, Mick. Omar knows about this stuff.
Representative Stockman is a leftist?
But yeah, I agree, it’s absolutely stupid to prevent soldiers from carrying their firearms lawfully.
And the idea of NYSAFE not disclosing to the public how many registered is genius. “People are registering their dangerous scary guns”
“Really? How many sign ups have you gotten out of the million plus dangerous scary guns?”
“Um… Can’t tell ya, BUUUUUT a lot.”
“Define a lot.”
“Gee, look at the time, I gotta go.”
Was thinking the same. Representative Steve Stockman is in no way a leftist (hard or otherwise).
Orgies: no one plans for them because no one expects them to happen.
May the NYSAFE Act’s registry have as long a life as the Canadian long gun registry, cost twice as much, and only be half as effective.
And someone correct me if I’m wrong, but this whole troops being disarmed on military bases seems to be left over from the Vietnam-era, when commanders were worried that conscripted troops would frag the officer class. I think we’re past those days, so it’s time to review some policies.
Actually the ban dates back to the Bush 1 and to the Clinton eras, Prior to that time base commanders set their own rules. Third paragraph of the linked article mentions it.
http://www.npr.org/2014/04/03/298754420/should-soldiers-be-armed-at-military-posts
actually you CAN plan a proper orgy. I used to work at a swingers club. you have to know your customers, have the proper equipment and refreshments, and invite accordingly.
we had a sybian in the open room. usually offering some sort of prize for the first woman on it got the party going.
Correct. Though the planning is mostly about setting up the basic necessities, planning for emergencies (including how to deal with someone whom has suddenly hit an unexpected hard limit), making sure the facilities are up-to-snuff, the refreshments are laid-in, and all the other contingencies.
What you CAN’T plan (beyond generalities) is what happens once folks ar e face-to-face.
Seems weird to me in regards to mil not being allowed to carry (if not issued but personal) weapons.
And they can’t exactly leave them in their barracks (AFAIK that is not allowed) so it can’t be an “Oh shit that guy has got an AK I need to get to my bunk” it is just a “Oh shit that guy has an AK I need to hide” before now.
Sure defending against someone who is going nuts with an AK (I think it wasn’t the weapon used but i’m just using it as an example here) while you only have a 9mm or 45 semiauto isn’t advisable it is alot better that having to deal with it bare handed if they enter the room you are in or dying.
Basically, if you live in barracks, your personal weapons get locked up in the arms room along with the issue ones. They then issue you a weapon card for your own firearm, and you check it out the same way you would an issue one. I had a couple of firearms while living off-post, sold ’em when I moved back on base.
This was late 1970s, Fort Sill.
A big part of not allowing firearms in the barracks involves young, drunken troops, and the stupidity that ensues. Seriously, you don’t want (more) guns in the barracks. But more on duty personal should be armed besides the base cops.
Agreed. I’ve been the Senior NCO in a barracks, and let me tell ya – Well, if you’re a veteran I don’t NEED to tell ya… But you civilians should listen and learn: Young soldiers can be remarkably stupid, especially when alcohol is added. And NCOs can’t be everywhere (despite legends to the contrary). Add weapons to that mix and you WILL have Bad. Things. Happen.
No reasons that folks on-duty can’t be armed, though. Having the CQ backed by an ACQ with a shotgun would be quite useful in a number of common scenarios.
You seriously believe it’s better to unarmed against a gunman than armed?
oops. I can’t read… carry on…
Having had to deal with this ban during my decade in the military, base commanders still have a wide berth in what they allow. While traveling to NAS China Lake in California I brought along my weapons. ( I never travel without at least a pistol.) As I hit the state line I put my .45 in the locking box in the trunk as required at the time by California law. When I got to the base, I informed the gate guard that I was going to be attending a school there and had weapons to check in to the armory. He pointed down the road said go down two intersections take a left and the armory was on the left. He advised me that I should probably leave the guns in the box when I walked in to cut down on the hastle. I checked them into the armory filled out a few forms and had nary a problem. Two months later I had another school this time in Mississippi. My texas concealed carry permit has reciprocity with Mississippi so I didn’t worry about it. I figured that if it was so easy in California, a state not known for their love of firearms, how much easier would it be in Mississippi, as deep a red state I had ever been to. As I approached the gate I informed the gate guard that I was armed ad needed directions to the armory to check in my personal weapons while I attended school. After being drawn upon and having my car searched I was escorted to the base armoy by armed personnel and made to check in to only my firearms but every knife I had over 3 inches in the vehicle including issued ones. I later found out that there was a complete ban on “weapons” on base and that the only reason I was being allowed to check in mine was that I was attending school. I would not be allowed to access my weapons until my stay was complete and then would have to be escorted off base with an armed escort again. Talk about a hastle. So while it is true that carrying firearms on base may be banned even possessing them is up to the base commander and many of those are so risk adverse that if you live on base you cant even keep them in your house. This shows a deeper problem within our military of risk adverse commanders and the problems they cause. JUst as on the civilian side these shootings are not the core issue, but just a symptom of a deeper and more worrying issue.
ya.., it’s pretty obvious that most of the people who posted on this subject don’t or haven’t taken an oath to protect and defend. Soldiers, Sailors, Airpersons, and Marines can and do own and bear arms. When in garrison there is a requirement to secure all firearms under double lock and key in the arms room unless on duty. POW’s (Personally Owned Weapons), which include non-firearm weapons, are issued a weapons card and secured in the unit arms room when not in personal use. Active duty servicemembers are never off duty and are under general orders at all times and are therefore restricted to issued weapons only for use of force by military law and only when under special instructions. Anyone who has ever been in combat or under attack to cause institutionalized terror knows you can’t stop the Golden Bullet. This incident was an attack. The appropriate defensive measures for an incident like this is an appropriately graded threat posture. Doctrinally it’s a blue on blue incident in a low threat postured garrison. Having an amber or red weapon, issued or personal, being ported by any number of on duty servicemembers would not have changed the attack. The attacker will always have the advantage because of timing and surprise.
You don’t believe a response time of probably less than a minute would have made a difference over a response time of ten minutes?
I think Peter’s point was more that if you change the conditions on the ground before the attack, you change the timing/conditions of the attack, so the advantage remains to the attacker – he chooses the time and the conditions under which he attacks, and will simply choose a time and a place where he’s got the capacity to inflict the harm he’s intending.
Correct.
As an ex-soldier, there are some very damn good reasons that we don’t let our troops carry on-base (and not just domestically – most of our overseas bases are essentially unarmed 99% of the time too).
There is just SO MUCH weapon handling that goes down during the time that weapons are out. And since they are training to point the weapons at people by pointing the weapons at each other, the odds of a negligent discharge approaches 1:1. You can’t use common sense gun rules like “never point a firearm at something you are not willing to destroy,” because they are routinely ordered to do exactly that. An unaccounted for round of ammo is a huge deal, because you never know if one of the 1,000 teenagers that day are going to fuck up. There is generally no “shoot/no shoot” training for soldiers, or any of the kind of restraint taught to police and civilians.
The military isn’t the real world. We give up a lot of rights when we enlist. We can no longer say “fuck you” to certain people, we can no longer choose to leave any time we want, we have no right to privacy (barracks inspections don’t need warrants), etc. And, yes, we give up our second amendment rights. Honestly, enlisting is pretty much voluntary prison.
I’m a standard pro-2A CCW/Class III collector type. Guns aren’t bad. People should be able to protect themselves. The thing is, these soldiers are in an institution, not free people with private lives.
There IS a way to address the problem though, and yes, it includes more guns. Pretty much every military unit from the dental assistants to the paratroopers all congregate as a unit. This is what makes them such vulnerable targets, for one. Units could have designated marksmen who are armed (and thus their sergeants can use their discretion from day to day to discreetly not assign the drunk ones or the people who just got a Dear John). Arm a percentage, and make them responsible for protecting the group.
Ah, it’s just so fucked up across the board.
By the logic thus far offered, police officers should also not be allowed to go armed when off duty, and maybe not usually when on duty. There are just as many young cops as young soldiers, and they drink just as much, they have just as many interpersonal conflicts and domestic problems, etc.
And when I was in the Army, there was no “training to point the weapons at people by pointing the weapons at each other” that I can recall. At least not when there weren’t blank adaptors on the muzzles, and most of the time not even then. Maybe things have changed; if so it’s for the worse. But we weren’t allowed arms most of the time back then, either.
Seriously though, don’t mix up the Purrell and KY. Holy Shit.
Oooh. That burns just thinking about it.
Never have hot wings as a snack as an orgy.
Likewise, nothing that involves Wasabi or Chinese mustard.
Thanks. I have been needing a “God Dammit, Omar!”
So… Train Man.
It really sounds like you had a problem with an enlisted Soldier, Sailor, Airperson or Marine who, while performing his/her assigned duties at a threat postured Entry Control point, followed his/her, their orders and instructions by a superior officer or non-commissioned officer. So it already sounds like you weren’t a leader of American servicemembers (because a real leader wouldn’t have made a statement like you made), which is odd because you would think that in 10 years you would have been at least promoted to E-5. Were you perhaps a civilian contractor?
And Dave The Great..
Where are these mythical 99% non-ported overseas bases? Because since 1999 I have been 5 years operating out of 3/4 of the bases in Afghanistan and over half in Iraq and every single operating base is green/amber weapons status. Sounds like you are less familiar with the bases in theater that are under constant attack or threat of attack and more familiar with those bases that are used for rest and recreation in the rear echelon. You know, the ones where combat Soldiers, Sailors, Airpersons or Marines who have spent months or years with their finger less than a centimeter from the trigger 24/7 go to relax and destress.